FAIRHOPE — An overflow crowd of concerned citizens attended Tuesday's Fairhope City Council meeting to discuss sexually explicit library books.
Around 30 people spoke at the meeting in support of the Fairhope Public Library following the threat of state funding being pulled due to non-compliance with new Alabama Public Library Service (APLS) rules.
Councilman Jay Robinson said he believed everyone there has the same goal. He asked for a show of hands from those who want to relocate sexually explicit materials from the teen or minor sections of the library. About half the room raised their hands. He then asked those who wished to keep sexually explicit materials in the teen or minor sections to raise their hands. No one raised their hands.
"That's my point, guys," Robinson replied. "I don't think anybody wants sexually explicit material in the teen section or the minor section of our library, and so my point is that the issue itself is not one that we disagree on."
Robinson continued, "Obviously, what we disagree on or what there seems to be a disagreement on or a misunderstanding of is what that definition of sexually explicit is."
Robinson said it's not up to the council to define what is "sexually explicit," but rather the APLS. He said the council would expect the library to follow those rules.
Several library supporters were educators who argued that it is best to let professionals decide what books are provided for juveniles. They said they felt the library was under attack.
"These days, we, instead of going to the experts we know we have, we keep going to amateurs and let them decide what's the best course for America," said Mary Kate Dean. "The professional librarians should be trusted. They know their jobs like you know your job."
Among the 11 people asking the council to ensure sexually explicit material is moved to the adult section was Dirk Anderson. Also an educator, Anderson said he moved his family to Fairhope from Minnesota six years ago for the conservative values.
"We are simply asking that books be moved to the adult section because there is pornographic material in these books," Anderson said. "It is not just three sentences long. Oftentimes, it is page after page after page of filth."
"We are asking to protect our kids with common-sense measures," he added.
Wendy Pickering said there is not a call to ban books but a demand to relocate sexually explicit material.
"Under the Alabama Constitution and the United States Constitution, it is well established that parents have a fundamental right to protect their children from sexually inappropriate material," Pickering said. "Allowing materials that describe graphic sexual activity in the children's or teen sections undermines parents' rights and presents dangerous matters and violates community trust."
Pickering said those attempting to protect children have been called "extremists."
"So, let's be clear," she said. "If this council continues to knowingly fund a library that exposes children to sexually explicit content without taking corrective action, we intend to pursue all lawful remedies available, including filing formal claims against your surety bonds for breach of your oath and failure to protect the public interest."
Doctor Kathleen Heath, a children's therapist in Fairhope, brought her stuffed animals to present child abuse statistics to the council. She said that if parents are uncomfortable with the books in the library, they should stay with their children.
Marine veteran and father of eight Nathaniel Spurgeon stood with his young son and asked the council to act responsibly to protect children.
"As a father who's held his child while they cried from confusion, trauma, or pain, I ask you to hear me, not as an activist, but as a parent who simply wants the library to be a place of learning, not a place of stumbling," Spurgeon pleaded. "This conversation is not a debate about censorship or banning ideas. It's about the conversation about responsibility; responsibility to protect young minds while still encouraging curiosity, growth and literacy."
Spurgeon's family experienced a traumatic event when his wife and mother-in-law were kidnapped and held for ransom. He said his family learned firsthand how trauma in libraries can impact victims of crime.
"It was very difficult for us to deal with," he explained. "My teen daughter read some books in the library that she thought would be cool, but they included instances of that trauma, and it relayed those things back to her."
"What I'm asking for us is to think constructively on what we do," he continued. "If we put the books in an area for guidance so that our children can be compelled to ask adults for help in navigating these important books because it can bring up trauma that they never knew that they felt, and it's very important to me."
Attorney Brian Dasinger pointed out that 75% of the people of Fairhope voted for President Donald Trump in November. He called on members of the public to come forward to run against the sitting council. He said his group has presented concerning materials to the council for a year and a half.
"I'm not saying this about you personally but as representatives of this city, you all are about as worthless as tits on a bull," Dasinger said. "And I would seriously consider whether you all want to run for re-election this year or not."
Councilman Jack Burrell responded to allegations that the council had not acted by reading a letter from APLS Chairman John Wahl confirming the library had complied with regulations.
"We do not condone violating the state law on this city council," Burrell said. "We, in fact, have said numerous times we will abide by the state law. We do not believe that our library has intentionally ever violated this state law."
"It is that when they have been asked to review books and they have been asked to review many, and I know that they have recently moved as many as six books," he continued. "So, to say that nothing's being done is also false. Books have been moved, other books are still in review."
Rebecca Watson, founder of Moms for Liberty Baldwin County, said that after addressing the council for over a year, she felt her hands were tied, so she presented information to the APLS. She read the APLS definition of sexually explicit and invited anyone concerned to go to Montgomery to the APLS meetings.
"If you don't like the policy, go up there, take your time away from your family, just like I have, and reverse the policy," she said. "So, if you don't like the policy, exercise your freedom, and go up there and ask them to change it."
Watson said library funding was paused because the Fairhope Library Board refused to review a list of about 30 challenged books.
"[Library board chairman] Anne Johnson warned them in that meeting that they needed to revisit the books. Four of them said, 'We're not interested," Watson said. "They ruled, and it was done. That is why they lost the funding in that moment. That is why it was paused, because those books, there are books on there that violate the APLS policies, and because they refused to revisit the books, they would have sat on the shelf for another three to four years after the APLS policies were put in place."
Watson claimed that 74% of the donations raised by Read Freely came from people who do not live in Fairhope, as they received help from a national organization.
Watson said her property has been vandalized, and she has been threatened by people who said they want to hang her from a tree.
"We should be able to come and have a conversation, but we can't do that in our library board meetings because we are attacked, we are called terrible names," she said.
Read Freely – Baldwin County Chapter founder Elizabeth Williams said there is a disconnect caused by what is considered obscene or harmful to minors. She said a formal definition of what is obscene or harmful should be clarified, similar to the definition in the Alabama code or the three-pronged Miller test.
"Semantics really do matter when we're talking about the law," Williams said. "Conduct is part of that second prong of the Miller test. Content is not addressed, sexually explicit, or sexual content is not addressed anywhere in state or federal law. The law is 'obscenity' or 'harmful for minors.'"
Furthermore, Williams stated that 41.6% of donations to the Fairhope Public Library came from local residents.
At least three local pastors addressed the council, asking members to ensure that sexually explicit materials are taken out of juvenile sections.
Council members made statements after public comment.
Councilman Corey Martin said he believes love is the answer to the disagreements over library books.
"You got one bureaucracy over here, you got one over here, and really, there's no resolution, there's no right or wrong," Martin said. "We should find a way to meet in the middle and protect the kids at all costs. I don't think no one here wants to hurt a child, and God knows, anybody that knows me, knows that I do not want to hurt a child."
Martin said citizens don't need to go against one another.
"Now we can't save everybody, we can show them love, and love will save them every time, I promise you," he said. "We can't say, 'You can't do that, you're wrong.' We may know they're wrong, but that's the freedom, that's the freedom."
Jimmy Conyers, the council liaison to the library board, said a review process is in place. He said he leans on the unpaid library board to do things the right way and will support them either way.
Robinson said the process in place should be legal and should be followed.
Sullivan said she has been in talks with Wahl about a possible appeals process.
"We like living in a democracy, we like living in a community where we can have a diversity of opinions and be respectful of that," said Sullivan. "So, I appreciate everybody working through our process of government and the library for working through their process of reviewing the books."
The library has a tiered system allowing parents to give permission for their children to check out books from the adult section.
The APLS is expected to vote on the future of funding for Fairhope Public Library at its next meeting on May 8.
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